EPISODE 37 OF WHAT WOULD THEY DO? THE CUSTOMER EXPERIENCE PODCAST FOR SMALL BUSINESS OWNERS
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In today’s episode, we’re diving into pre-selling, Anticipation Marketing™, and how to create sales environments that build deep trust, long-term loyalty, and better-fit buyers.
We’re answering this listener question:
“How can pre-selling build a deeper trust with your audience and set the stage for long-term customer loyalty?”
To unpack this question, I’ve invited none other than Brenna McGowan, the queen of Anticipation Marketing™, the creator of the Pre-Launch Plan Program, and an advocate for launch strategies that actually feel good for you and your audience.
If you’re tired of high-pressure launch tactics, endless email blasts, and buyers who ghost after checkout, Brenna’s approach will feel like a breath of fresh air. We explore her signature framework and how pre-selling isn’t just about priming people to buy, but about attracting the right people who’ll stick around.
Brenna is also joining Retention Lab as our November guest expert on 19 November 2025. If you want access to her live training (or the replay if you’re listening later), join us now.
What we cover:
Why traditional launches create burnout (and how to avoid it)
The 4 A’s of Anticipation Marketing
How to create a low-pressure sales environment that converts better
The surprising link between pre-selling and customer retention
Smart ways to front-load trust and reduce refund requests
The one thing Brenna recommends you must do weekly during pre-launch
How audience research shapes magnetic messaging that resonates
Soundbites:
Brenna McGowan: “In traditional launch models, especially when I started to talk about this back in 2021, it went, okay, we’re going to do a webinar and we’re going to open the cart and then we’re going to pound people with sales emails for seven days and then we’re going to close the cart. What I wanted to do is create an environment that created anticipation and time so people were actually looking forward to what I was about to sell or what my clients and customers or students are about to sell. Not like these high urgency, high pressure type of launches.”
Brenna McGowan: “You start to call in better fit clients, people who are more motivated to do the work that are going to stick around longer. Because sometimes when people buy last moment, they have that regret or they purchase because they were feeling itchy inside about the problem that they were having and they buy quickly.”
More about my guest, Brenna McGowan:
Brenna McGowan is a launch strategist, copywriter, and the creator of the popular online event Behind the Launch. She helps coaches, course creators, and consultants move away from hustle-based, high-pressure launches by using my signature pre-launch and Anticipation Marketing™ strategies.
Website: https://brennamcgowan.co/
Instagram: www.instagram.com/brennamcgowanco
Download Brenna’s Launch Calendar
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Episode Transcript:
Nadine Nethery (00:00)
Hello, hello and welcome back to the podcast. Thanks so much for tuning in. I always appreciate you ⁓ coming back week after week. So let’s get straight into it. Today’s question for the episode is how can pre-selling build a deeper trust with your audience and set the stage for long-term customer loyalty? When I considered who to invite
there really wasn’t anyone but Brianna McGowan, she’s the authority on pre-selling with her signature anticipation marketing strategies. And to be honest, I’ve been binging her content, everything she’s been putting out for years, whether it’s her online summits or on social media, she’s just so clever when it comes to priming your audience to be ready to purchase, but also.
stick around and fall in love with your brand. So welcome to the show Brenna.
Brenna McGowan (00:52)
Thank you, I’m so happy to be here.
Nadine Nethery (00:53)
⁓ Before we dive into the topic, I just wanted to give you a quick heads up: I also have the honor to welcome her as our November retention lab guest expert. She’s going to host a life workshop for members on the 19th of November. If you’re in Australia, 18th, if you’re, know, towards the US side of the world.
And she’s going to be diving deeper into her signature pre-selling strategies. So if you’re tuning in live as this episode airs, and you resonate with what Brenna is going to share with us and what we’re going to discuss on the episode, then absolutely check out Retention Lab via the link in the show notes. And if you’re catching this episode at a later stage, you can catch the replay of this live session as soon as you join the lab. And now let’s get into the episode.
So obviously I’m familiar with who you are, your genius and your strategies. But before we dive in, ⁓ do you mind introducing yourself, sharing a little bit about who you are, how you got to where you are today and tell us a little bit about your signature anticipation marketing framework.
Brenna McGowan (02:00)
Yes, no, thank you again for having me. I’m really excited. And I actually got into business by accident. Back in 2018, I was about to turn 40. And I was like, gosh, I remember saying like, I don’t want to be someone’s assistant for the rest of my life. Not that there’s anything wrong. I just felt like I had something bigger out there.
And also I joke that I started my business a little bit out of vanity. Like I had three kids. I know you have three kids too, Nadine. I think, know, it’s not a lot of extra money for the moms lying around. So I was like, if I can make $500 extra a month and I can like pay the electric bill and get occasional Botox, because I was going into my midlife, I’d be really happy. And I got like sucked into this online vortex we call the online business world.
And I actually started off as a social media manager and I hated it. I always say like, God bless the social media managers. And from there, I quickly transitioned over into email copywriting and through my email copywriting, and I was actually writing all kinds of copy, but I started to write launch copy. And with the launch copy, I actually had a couple, two launches that stick out in my mind, one in particular that just flopped.
And I really started to ask some questions, which is what was missing from this launch? And what I felt like was missing was we didn’t do a pre-launch at all. We assumed that people in our audience were ready to buy and that assumption cost us. And I also wondered like, why can I write copy sometimes that converts super high? And why does sometimes these things fall flat? Like, and I wanted to find some consistency in these sales and promotions we were doing.
And so through that process, I discovered pre-launch and also pre-launch became pre-selling, which I know we’re going to focus on today and overall anticipation marketing, is the larger now copyrighted part of my brand, which is how can we, instead of creating these high pressure sales environments,
How can we instead create sales environments that feel really good to our clients and customers and use some of these anticipation marketing strategies that we’re going to talk about today?
Nadine Nethery (04:21)
Yeah. I love your take on anticipation marketing, like the whole approach and the way you frame the process of selling is just really in line with my take on custom experience and putting your
customer, your audience first, even during a launch where clearly you’re needing to make sales. Can you share a little bit more about ⁓ what makes your approach to launching somewhat different to that traditional launch model? Traditional launching involves, opening the cart, closing the tart. That’s how we’re being told to launch by a lot of the online gurus. So how would you describe
anticipation marketing to someone who is completely new to the online launching space.
Brenna McGowan (05:03)
Yes, so there’s different facets of it. But what I really think about anticipation marketing is first and foremost, there’s, I call it like four A’s of anticipation marketing. So the first one is to actually build anticipation. And in order to build anticipation, you need time to build anticipation. So in traditional launch models, you know, especially when I started to talk about this, you know, back in originally 2021, 2022, which was like, okay, we’re going
to a webinar and we’re going to open the cart and then we’re going to pound people with sales emails for seven days and then we’re going to close cart and at the same time we’re going to use a lot of like last chance and urgency and scarcity and I don’t have a problem with urgency and scarcity. I just think some I think the pendulum like swung too far.
And in my opinion, that’s not the way I like to be sold to. And so what I wanted to do is create an environment that created anticipation and time. So people were actually looking forward to what I was about to sell or what my clients and customers or students are about to sell. Not as much as this high urgency, high pressure type of launches. The other thing that’s really important, the second A in anticipation marketing is autonomy, which is really giving your
prospect or potential client, the information they need to make the best buying decision for themselves. And a lot of times it’s really hard to do in a seven day, 10 day open cart period, right? Like we need time. About half of us, according to disc, are slower decision makers and others are faster decision makers. Some people thrive on making a decision and making it quickly. Other people like me can’t.
can’t handle it, like it’s too much. need time to process. if I feel like you’re pressuring me, I actually like back away instead of move forward. And so I wanted to help people like me that wanted to sell like me figure out like, how can I do this in a way where I’m still selling? Like I want you to buy my thing, but I want it to be a really great decision for you. And I want you to feel like it’s your decision. The third A is assurance, which is building a lot of trust.
in you as the person that’s going to help someone get the desired transformation that they’re looking for. And trust has been a huge topic in the online world in 2025. And it’s baked into anticipation marketing because of the things that we already talked about. And last but not least, which is the part that I love, when we get to, a copywriter. So copywriting is conversion, which is writing.
copy that converts to a sale. sometimes during or not sometimes during launch, but during the launch, we have to write in a way that gets people to make a yes or no decision, right? That just that that comes with the nature of the game. I love stories and really like, you know, thinking of things and creating analogies and creating fun ways to sell your stuff that doesn’t feel like a high pressured sale. So with anticipation marketing, with doing pre-launching, you’re able to use story to fuel your sales versus maybe that more straightforward copy that you have to write during a launch period.
Nadine Nethery (08:23)
So clever, People take a lot longer, as you said, to make that purchase decision. So yeah, such a smart move. Also, a lot of online launches,
currently from what I’m seeing involve like six, seven emails a day during the open cart period where it feels like, that mantra, the more emails I send, the more sales I’m going to make is being embraced. ⁓ So I love how your approach really spreads things out and gives people more breathing space rather than just seven days of
millions of emails per day. I personally don’t believe in more emails equal more sales. It’s about the right mix, as you said, you know, really touching on all the important aspects, the trust element, ⁓ social proof, also giving people the information to make that decision, super important. So I’d love to hear from you as someone who’s worked with so many online business owners within your program and on a one-on-one basis.
Is there a type of pre-selling content or messaging that can create both excitement and trust in one hit? Coming from a perspective where we’re trying to maximise the impact an email we’re sending has.
Brenna McGowan (09:34)
Yes.
I’ll kind of tie it back to what you just said, because what I see a lot, especially from people that are sending six or seven emails a day, what they’re trying to do is they’re trying to do a lot of the what I consider you need to be doing in that pre phase, know, pre selling pre launching the four to six weeks before you launch, they’ve skipped it. And now they have to do so much heavy lifting during their sales period. And so a lot of times, you know, when I look at these type of emails, I think, okay, this, this
was already they didn’t think you know it’s so much easier to sell to someone who is ready to be sold to who you you’re solving the problem that they already know that they have and they want to solve and that’s what we talk a lot about during the pre-launch where a lot of times we’re trying to
squish in, I say, like this time where we’re trying to show someone what their problem is and why it’s so important for them to solve it and then also make a decision about buying and also like it just becomes a lot.
And that’s exactly what we do inside the pre-launch plan program, which is like, how can we get someone excited? And then how can we build trust at the same time? it goes back to one thing that’s really important is, and it seems so obvious, but just tell people what you have coming up in the future. We get so busy working on the next promotion that our forward-facing marketing doesn’t actually tell people what’s coming up.
And
so that’s number one, right? Creating that anticipation. you know, depending on how you do it, and these are the types of things that we work on inside my program, which is, you you can create anticipation by also like changing the way that someone thinks about their problem. Seeing the way that their perspective changes, future pacing them into like what is next if they solve this problem.
Those are the types of things that we do. Now, how do you do this while building trust? Well, first of all, like showing people what you’re up to and showing behind the scenes type of content, going and sharing customer stories. A lot of times what I see is that people will wait till the launch to start sharing.
testimonials and case studies. And I am actually think no, we actually need to front load our people with the transformation that people are having, especially in 2025, when once again, people have been, you know, burned, they have spent a ton of money on things that haven’t worked. You know, I think about someone who joined my program last time, and she was just like, I don’t want this to be the next thing that doesn’t work. And I was like,
Like I felt
that so deeply and I bet a lot of my audience feels that very deeply. So I was able to take her words and you know, turn them around and use that in my launch cycles. So really it’s doing, and this is like the non-sexy part of what I do, but it’s so incredibly important. And inside the pre-launch plan program right now, I have people, we’re doing customer research and market research. And it’s the part that people drag their feet even when they join my program.
and they think, I don’t wanna do this, and then we do it, and it opens their eyes of how wonderful it is when you actually talk to real human beings and not solely use AI. But not only that, is that when you can start reflecting back to someone exactly how they’re feeling, and the only way to do that is to go out and talk to people. It’s not to create these scenarios in your head or make assumptions, but to actually talk to prospective people.
that are thinking about buying from you. Talk to the people that have bought from you. And when you can start reflecting those things and those topics back, but in a fun, relatable way using stories, then you start to build trust in a way that it really resonates with someone. Because they feel like you know them.
Nadine Nethery (13:29)
Funnily enough, ⁓ last week’s episode touched on exactly that topic. Audience research, actually having conversations with people and ⁓ what I find, so I do audience research for my one-on-one clients as well. So very strategic. I dig through the findings and come up with those aha moments and ⁓ those golden nuggets that you just talked about.
And it can be so powerful to then incorporate that in your pre-launch process, as you said, and it takes the pressure off that cart open period. Half the exhaustion from launching comes from cramming too many things into that one week and thinking you have to do everything in that one week. from what I can see from your clients is like they spread it out so nicely. They take the pressure off. They’re seeing clients and roll before card even opens and it just.
turns it into this beautiful process for not only you as the business owner, but also for the audience where it feels like this gradual process that builds to the cart open period. They’re ready, they’re primed, they know what it’s about. And it’s not this big flood of information that is so much to process, particularly when inboxes are full and we’re being bombarded with messages left, right and center.
If you haven’t listened to last week’s episode, make sure you tune in and check it out. So in your experience, is there one magical pre-launch touch point or pre-sales touch point that makes the biggest impact in shaping someone’s perception of your brand?
Brenna McGowan (14:57)
Well, it goes back to which once again seems obvious, this is why I believe in pre-launching so much, because I think different people in your audience need to hear different things, which is why we have like different themes for the weeks of like pre-launch and what we do before we actually launch because what is going to resonate with one person may weigh just like you kind of like discard it while someone else might be like, my gosh, that’s the thing that I needed to hear.
So I think you need to have a variety of content that’s going out during that time. And I always say if you’re going to do one thing and it’s more of an action than it is a like a topic, which is I always say people need to hear you or see you once a week during pre-launch, especially right now. I know I keep saying it, but it’s just true is that, know, I think you can be creative on how
they see you or hear you anything from a voice note to your podcast podcast episode to lives. But I am always encouraging people to like people need to actually hear you see you so that they they feel like you know that like when you talk to someone or you hear someone on a podcast you feel like okay like I can know who they are I can I can sense it better.
So that would be the one thing that’s like my, you have to do it. I don’t think I say a lot of times, like I don’t have a lot of like hard rules when it comes to marketing, but to me, that’s one of the hard and fast rules. And even when I don’t feel like it myself, I remind myself like, okay, for, this many weeks, I’m committing to showing up and okay, if something happens and I skip a week,
This is why love pre-launch as well because a lot of times life comes up like we talked about we have three kids life parents internet issues, right? Like someone someone that needs to be rushed to the doctor even last week. My kids are adults now like young adults and my daughter came home from college and was super sick like like these are the things that come up that when you are able to spread out your sales cycle a little bit more it doesn’t like tank your launch when something happens. I think about a client that I have
a previous student and she did her prelaunch. She actually did some pre-selling. She had people already taking a part of her membership and her actual launch promotion date came up and her mom fell and was in the hospital on launch day and she was like, thank God I did the prelaunch because I would not have been able to make it through this launch had I not done this work up upfront.
One thing I want to say too is when people hear me saying this, like, my gosh, you’re telling me I have to sell longer or I got to do like more stuff, right? I know. So I really want to break down to like, I always say, yeah, we probably need some heightened visibility during our pre-launch period, but you’re most likely creating some forms of content anyway. You’re sending emails, you’re, you’re doing some of these things anyway. We’re just being really smart and strategic about
the types of topics, the things that we’re talking about before it goes out, you know, more so than just creating content for creating content sake.
Nadine Nethery (18:13)
I love how while you have your framework, it’s still flexible and it works with people’s personalities. You can show up on your podcast, it can be social media. I personally, we talked about this before we kicked off, Í’m not a huge fan of showing up on social media all the time. So I heavily lean into podcast episodes in the lead up to promotions that I’m running. And ⁓ the beauty of your framework is it really works with
different content formats that people are creating anyway. It’s just about being more intentional and actually planning things out, paying attention to what your audience needs to hear and then being strategic about how you put it out into the world.
Coming at this topic from a customer retention perspective, because you know, love customer retention and really leaning into the long-term relationships with your customers.
how does pre-selling influence customer retention and customer loyalty down the track? What’s your take on that?
Brenna McGowan (19:11)
Yeah, well, if we go back to one of the four A’s, which is autonomy, which is when we feel like we made a decision for ourselves, and we feel really autonomous in that decision, then we are, and there’s some science behind this, which I won’t nerd out too much, but like you are more internally motivated, and when we’re more internally motivated, we get results.
One of the things when I first started doing this process with people was my very first client was like, oh my gosh, like everyone who came into my program was just like the best fit client. And I’ve heard it over and over again. I’m like,
I never even thought about this. Like, I never thought about how these people who did went through this process, they just were like such a better fit. So when we have better fit clients, we get people in there once again, and you get people who are motivated to take action, they get better results, they really see you, your container, however you’re helping them as the thing that helped them get to that place.
and they stick around longer. And I know like the last time that pre-launch plan program, I’m almost positive. I have like a caveat, cause I’d have to go through, I should have looked at the numbers. I think I had like a 40 % retention in terms of people that worked with me, who decided to stay with me after the pre-launch plan program and coach with me in my container that I call after the launch. And this is what I see is that you start to call them better fit clients, people who are doing better work.
who are not better work, more motivated to do the work that are going to stick around longer. Because sometimes when people buy last moment, they have that like regret or they just purchase because they were trying to like, they were feeling itchy inside about the problem that they were having and they buy quickly. And I’ve seen it too. And this was the first time I’ve had this happen with, least I think it was the first time. I’ve seen it more actually maybe the second time where.
Like in the past, people would buy my program, but I’ve had, I’ve been using some more affiliate sales this last couple of times, which I think are great. But I had someone this round the program who was like, bought and like, I was like, I need a refund. Like they bought and they had like immediate and they had just found me. And thankfully we ended up talking. She’s with, she’s in my program right now. She’s stuck around and she’s getting great results.
But you know, there is that like, it also lessens the chance of refunds because someone’s actually thought about their decision before being like, crap, doors are closing and I better buy now and then regretting it right after.
Nadine Nethery (21:45)
Yeah, and it’s so true, rather than selling for the sake of selling and getting anyone into a program who potentially isn’t in the right place to get the best outcomes from your program. Being more conscious and priming people to work out themselves, whether this is the right program for them, whether they are actually in a position to get the best results is just so smart because yeah, churn rate is minimal, refunds are minimal.
And it just attracts the right people who probably have been lurking in the background anyway. And all they needed was this beautiful runway to open cart. Thank you so much Brenna. I absolutely love your approach to pre-selling. It just really resonates with me as someone who hates live launching with a passion. So taking that pressure off and just turning it into a longer process. ⁓
makes it so much more manageable. So thank you so much for sharing your genius. I can’t wait to hear what you have to share with my members in a Retention Lab middle of November. Before we wrap up, I have one question I ask all my guests and that is around your personal customer experience, headaches, objections, hurdles, problems. So what is keeping you up at night when it comes to your customer experience?
Brenna McGowan (22:58)
I would say right now what’s on top of mind for me is AI and I’ve integrated AI, but I think it’s like, am I, am I doing enough AI to keep up?
and to keep up with what my clients and customers need to help them. But on the flip side, is it too much? Like, do my people even want this much AI? I’ve been thinking about like different AI solutions, but then I wonder, do I need these? So think that’s what’s keeping me up at night is like, I want to provide great customer experience inside the program. And because of the nature of what we do inside the program, AI can come in and help and do some heavy lifting.
we do research, we do strategy, we do copy, which is all great, but it’s not necessarily the, you know, as sexy as like some of the other things that you might want to do for your business. So I think it’s like, okay, when is, when is AI enough? And how do I keep up with this, this engine that I feel like is like steamrolling and making sure that I’m doing enough
to keep my customers happy, but not so much as well where it drives me crazy or drives them crazy because I’m introducing new things.
Nadine Nethery (24:05)
Yeah.
Yeah, such a common issue, isn’t it? Like I feel AI is so hard to keep up with in the first place. And then when it comes to integrating it into your offers ⁓ as you said, it’s that fine line between, what’s helpful, what’s overwhelming, what can they take off your plate as the coach without taking over the one on one components and your unique perspective. So
Great question. Leave it with me. I’ll get someone on the show to hopefully give us some answers and some guidance Before we wrap up, obviously I want people to connect with you online. So where can people find you?
Brenna McGowan (24:39)
Yes. So you can find me on Instagram if you want to come say hi, please do. I’d love for you to say hello. And you can also find me at brendanmcgowan.co forward slash launch calendar. have a launch calendar there. So if you’re like, okay, you’ve talked so much about like six weeks, but what do I actually do during these six weeks or how can I create a calendar? Speaking of AI, I have this beautiful ⁓ AI tool that helps you plan out your pre-launch calendar and probably ⁓
around the beginning of December, actually gonna make this a paid tool. So go, if you’re listening right now, go grab it and get it while it’s still free.
Nadine Nethery (25:15)
Awesome. listeners, make sure you check it out. I’ll link it all up in the show notes. Thank you so much for coming on the show Brenna. It was so good. And as I said, I can’t wait to chat with you ⁓ again in November in the Lab. So listeners, if you have a burning customer experience question, you would like an awesome guest like Brenna or myself to answer, please use the link in the show notes to submit your question.
and if you enjoyed today’s episode make sure you subscribe leave a review and share it with your biz besties. Thank you so much for tuning in and I’ll chat to you next week.
